ever_neutral: ([random] obligatory gpoy)
[personal profile] ever_neutral
Quickly quickly because PEOPLE INSIST ON EXISTING IRL:


I'm interpreting "gender fuckery" broadly fyi. It's not that the following characters TOTALLY UPEND gender norms but that certain elements of their presentation subvert what one usually would expect. In alphabetical order b/c that's the way I roll:


1) Buffy motherfucking Summers, a.k.a. the thing monsters have nightmares about. For being completely conventionally feminine and simultaneously a warrior woman. I know we all hate Joss and that he is Problematic &c. &c. but still, Buffy Summers exists. Your typical "ditzy" Californian blonde who only cares about shopping and gossiping about boys, whom every other horror story would deem fit to be killed off for her femininity. I am all for unfeminine women on TV, I really am, but -- much like my undying love for Legally Blonde -- it means a lot to me that Buffy didn't have to be masculinised in order to be the hero of the story. Her strength was in silly womanly things like emotions. And regardless of how you feel about the finale being PROBLEMATIC, I think we should all agree that taking an axe to everything the Council of Patriarchs stood for was in itself to be endorsed.


2) Darla. Because of that motherfucking first episode of BtVS where she opens the show in a Catholic schoolgirl uniform which, of course, she uses to lure the innocent male prey. When it comes to using traditional femininity as a weapon in order to eat men Darla is the role model to which we should all aspire. I also have a lot of feelings about her more or less being the boss of the Fanged Four, about how she was really the one who sired Angel and groomed him to be the monster he became (similar to Dru siring and grooming Spike -- lots of monstrous mothers in this verse). Behind every great man is an even greater woman, or so they say. (And yes, I am aware of how the horrific maternal plot over on AtS made Darla the expected sacrificial woman, but this is a happy post.)


3) Eowyn of Rohan. FORMATIVE BITCH. Fearless mofo who dressed herself up in dudes' clothes and went to fight for Minas Tirith in defiance of the gilded cage her family would rather have kept her in. (Some Mulan bullshit right there btw.) And when Witch-King dude got in her way and boasted that no living man could defeat him, Eowyn pulled off her helmet and said BOW DOWN BITCH FOR I AM NO MAN (#hairflip). Word.


4) Kara Thrace. Because gender-swapping the original BSG series' beer-sculling, cussing, womanising, thrill-seeking ~bad boy~ character was a stroke of fabulous. As opposed to 1) and 2) on this list, Kara was an emotional idiot. Her strengths lay mostly in the masculine space-battling domain -- she was pretty much the best fighter pilot in the fleet; meanwhile, her people skills left, er, something to be desired. She was a deep-feeling character, but she'd rather have a boxing match than talk about her feelings. (My woman.)


5) And I'm tentatively putting Katniss Everdeen here, too, after reading this article. (And no, we do not talk about the epilogue.) lbr Katniss's existence is also fuckery in a systemic sense in that it laughs at the idea that a woman-centric action movie franchise cannot sell.





I read the books/watched the movies a long, long time ago so bear with my memory. Random non-definitive FEELS:

  • CHILDHOOD.

  • PERFECT SERIES.

  • Formative bitch.

  • Neurotic drama queen with a temper = intro post.

  • Loved that she was defined/defined herself mostly by her brain.

  • BUT also loved that she was super emotional and idealistic. I remember reading some article somewhere about how Hermione Granger is such a rare important female character because she's "allowed to be both super intelligent and emotional". Well, I ::heart:: Hermione, but HAAAAAVE YOU MET ANNE SHIRLEY?

  • Although it wasn't a SUPER ANGSTY series, I liked how you could tell that Anne was kind of a sad and messed up person (at least at the start) in that she pretty much held herself together as a kid by escaping into her imagination. I understand you, Anne.

  • As a kid I liked that it was a hopeful story insofar as Anne started off as an unwanted misfit batted around from foster home to foster home but finally found a ~place to belong~ with Matthew and Marilla and so was able to come into her own. (LISTEN, THIS SERIES IS LIKE ONE OF TWO THINGS I LIKED AS A CHILD THAT DID NOT FUCK ME UP FOR LIFE. TELL NO ONE.)

  • Anne/Gilbert is the OTP. In fact, I am pretty sure they were the origins of my BEST FRIENDS WHO REGRETTABLY FALL IN LOVE kink. Though, they worked out in the end (thank God -- one Jo/Laurie is bad enough).

  • Speaking of which, I also always loved that Anne was such an emotional idiot. One of my fave parts of the book/movie is when Marilla tells her that she's so hung up on stories and fantasies that she can't recognise her attachment to real people. I FEEL DATZZZZ.

  • Yay @ Anne getting to see through her personal dreams and ambitions and get everything she wanted.

  • But also yay that her coming of age arc was in a lot of ways about fantasy v.s. reality and, I guess, learning how to make the two co-exist. As in, life does not always turn out the way you have planned, and sometimes the things you thought you wanted turn out not to be what you really want after all, and that can be cool too.

  • I like to think I could reread the series today and still feel exactly the same way.

Date: 2013-12-16 03:39 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] youcallitwinter.livejournal.com
LISTEN, LET ME LOVE YOU. I AM FEELING BAD THAT WE HAVE SO MUCH TO CATCH UP ON AND I'M MIA. YOU AND ELEONORE ARE THE WORST TBQH, AND I NEED TO LISTEN TO THAT PLAYLIST YESTERDAY OMG also listen, I mucho appreciate that it's an audio playlist, because my first intro to any music HAS to be audio for me, the audio-visual round and my mad love for it comes later after I have been audio-ed, it is a thing.

ALSO, I HAVE NOT SEEN THE HEIRS FINALE :\\\\\\\\\\ But dude, I saw the 19th episode and Ki-ae/Hee-nam = MOTHERFUCKING OTP (I just had a total 6-year-old giggly moment at my own use of motherfucking right here, um). Like, this show did lots of things and lots of interesting character and relationships EXCEPT THE OTP but that is one kind of relationship that I literally cannot remember ever having seen being given space in anything I've ever seen. I mean bromances are par for the course, every kind of media has now caught on that bromances work 4 every1 for some reason, but to have two middle-aged women bro-ing it out IN THE BEST WAYS POSSIBLE BECAUSE IT'S A LOVE-HATE RELATIONSHIP DON'T YOU KNOW, just, WHERE, Y'KNOW??? (I also fast forwarded through all of KT/ES honestly, except that part where KT cowed over 'finally being average at something' which i thought was pretty funny in general, and then ended with Young Do literally being 50 times better than him at everything, so that was good.) BESIDES BONA AND EUN-SANG GETTING ALL HAIR-CLIPPY ABOUT PRETTY BOYS FROM ANOTHER SCHOOL, JUST. AND RACHEL AND YOUNG DO AND THEIR SEXY NON-SIBLINGNESS.

omg, my days must also be coming, right??? THIS MEANS I'LL FINALLY BE GETTING YOUR COFFEE HOUSE THOUGHTS RIGHT????? I AM SITTING HERE BITING MY NAILS TILL THAT TIME KTHXBYE.

ALSO, ALSO,

ANNE SHIRLEY, CAN I JUST. FORMATIVE CHILDHOOD INFLUENCE NUMBER ONE, NEGL. THERE IS NO ONE EVER THAT I HAVE FELT FOR AS MUCH AS I FELT FOR ANNE. SHE WAS MY SPIRIT ANIMAL OKAY. I think those books were the first Big Books I read, post the Enid Blyton stage i.e. the print was small and there were so many pages and it was old-fashioned and slower than I was used to and they're my favorites. Like, from where I'm sitting right now I can see my entire Anne of Green Gables collection and it makes me so happy, JUST, GUH. I also have all the other ones, like the Emily series, The Story Girl, etc. etc., but the Anne ones are still my absolute faves. Apart from which my faves also included The Road To Yesterday and The Blue Castle, because those two were also legit perfect. AND ANNE AND GILBERT. CARROTS. FOREVER LOVERS. AND HE PERSISTS IN STICKING AROUND IN HER DREAM CASTLE THOUGH SHE WANTS HIM OUT. ugh ugh ugh, I just used to love that series so much, there are no words. Everything about it was perfect, just perfect. And life not turning out the way you'd imagined and having to watch that beautiful, flighty boy-loving classmate waste away and die (Rubyyyyyy :(((((() but maybe that boy you love won't die because he got caught in the rain and life does both those things. YOU HAVE REIGNITED MY FEELS IS WHAT.

1000000% with you on the characters i recognize in the first gender fuckery bit, i.e. Darla and Katniss and Buffy because <3333333333333333333333333333333 I WROTE THE EXACT SAME THING IN PAPER ABOUT BUFFY SOMETIME. Like, I know there's a lot of criticism that Buffy gets for the SMG casting and the typical-slim-white-californian-blonde thing, but the subversion of patriarchy's ideal of womanhood through patriarchy's ideal woman????? GIVE MEEEEEEE. And Darla is magnificent. There are no words.
Edited Date: 2013-12-16 04:47 pm (UTC)

Date: 2013-12-17 04:31 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com
SHE'S ALIVE

also listen, I mucho appreciate that it's an audio playlist, because my first intro to any music HAS to be audio for me, the audio-visual round and my mad love for it comes later after I have been audio-ed, it is a thing.

I knew it.

I'd advise saving the playlist later as aggressive retro dance-pop isn't conducive to exam studying (are your exams still a thing???) BUT ONCE YOU DO, YOU MUST REPORT TO ME YOUR IMPRESSIONS. (NAMELY: DO YOU LOVE TRACK 11 OR DO YOU NOT LOVE TRACK 11 BECAUSE ELEONORE AND I HAD AN EXPLOSIVE BATTLE OVER WHICH BALLAD TO INCLUDE. WORDS WERE SAID.) (I WON, OBVIOUSLY.)

(I just had a total 6-year-old giggly moment at my own use of motherfucking right here, um).

Never change.

WORD TO YOUR MOTHER (teehee) ON THE ONE TRUE BROMANCE THAT IS KI-AE/HEE-NAM. One of the greatest things from the show, the end. For all my rage about the show's gender issues wrt its CENTRAL RELATIONSHIP (WHY), they got it SO RIGHT with literally all its other female characters????? /o\ /o\ /o\

(People shading Tan's grades 4 life. BUT WHAT EVEN WAS EUN-SANG FANGIRLING OVER YOUNG-DO'S 27TH PLACE??? TROLL ON, SHOW, TROLL ON.)

"Are all the girls at your school so pretty?"/"We are the prettiest." I'M GLAD EUN-SANG SAID THAT TBH BECAUSE HER INITIAL BITCHING THAT BO-NA SHOULDN'T SEE HER AS A THREAT BECAUSE SHE (Eun-sang) WASN'T PRETTY WAS NOT CONVINCING WITH PARK SHIN-HYE IN THE ROLE.

ALSO: "Shall we go to a SEXY SUSHI PLACE?" GOD BLESS.

You must watch the finale ASAP or else be barred from your Eun-sang/Young-do manifesto of pain and doom (WHICH I AM SUPPOSED TO POST TODAY FML).

I am finishing the second last episode of Coffee House as we speak. Let me just leave that there. (WHAT EVEN IS THIS WEDDING SCENE. I'M ROLLIN'.)

YOU HAVE REIGNITED MY FEELS IS WHAT.

HAPPY NEWS. Everything what you said except your memory of the series is better than mine. OF COURSE YOU STAN FOR ANNE AND SHIP ANNE/GILBERT, IT COULD BE NO OTHER WAY.

I WROTE THE EXACT SAME THING IN PAPER ABOUT BUFFY SOMETIME.

OF COURSE YOU DID. Carry on.

Date: 2013-12-16 05:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
it means a lot to me that Buffy didn't have to be masculinised in order to be the hero of the story. Her strength was in silly womanly things like emotions. And regardless of how you feel about the finale being PROBLEMATIC, I think we should all agree that taking an axe to everything the Council of Patriarchs stood for was in itself to be endorsed.

Oh my YES. My friend Kendra finally watched WTTH/The harvest (at my frequent urgings), loved Buffy immediately and specifically remarked on the fact that she knew what nail polish was in vogue that season, and being able to slay vamps.

The thing that surprises me is when people in fandom Buffy described as "too masculine" because she's "angry/bitchy/mean to Spike/rescues Spike (so which is it? damned if she does and damned if she doesn't.) But one of my pet peeves is when people take an interesting, complex character and reduce them to a single characteristic, which happens in every fandom I've seen to both male and female characters.

Date: 2013-12-17 03:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com
\o/ Good on your Kendra, she may continue.

Ha, the gender fuckery in Buffy/Spike is one of my favorite things about them too. (And it's not just Spike -- she was also always rescuing Angel and Riley too). Buffy is compelling because she is a mix of both "masculine" and "feminine", the end.

Date: 2013-12-17 01:58 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
Kendra is an amazing woman btw; half my age and she's one of my heros and role models in so many ways. And I know she's going to love Spike; he's right up her alley re: the sorts of male protagonists she often writes.

(And it's not just Spike -- she was also always rescuing Angel and Riley too)

I love the parallels in the way she "rescues" and cares for all three of her men when they are wounded in or over their hearts: the matching imagery is gorgeous because it says so much about Buffy as "the Hand" in terms of caregiver as well as warrior (again the mix of masculine/feminine); and as their "Heart". And which of them in the end is best able to accept her and what she has to offer without feeling "unmanned": "more than" rather than "less".

Date: 2013-12-16 09:19 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pocochina.livejournal.com
(1) Yes, excellent gender-fuck list! I like that *some* of them are emotional basket-cases and some aren't, WHAT A CONCEPT OMG.

(2) ANNE ♥

Date: 2013-12-17 03:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com
(1) lol, glad you approve.
(2) ANNE INDEED ♥

Date: 2013-12-17 04:45 am (UTC)
next_to_normal: (hee)
From: [personal profile] next_to_normal
I APPROVE OF THESE CHOICES. Formative bitch, indeed.

Date: 2013-12-17 07:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com
Happy to get the other Eowyn's seal of approval. ;)

Date: 2013-12-17 07:05 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] woobloo.livejournal.com
WHAT A GOOD.

Buffy. THE PLAY BETWEEN MASCULINE AND FEMININE YES YES. Like, she is ~blonde and likes ~boys and ~shopping and beyond that, she identifies so strongly as "just a girl." And yet she so often acts the masculine role esp. with her relationships and she definitely embodies the angsty action hero trope (in the best way possible) and ugh. She's just... the legitimate best ok.

And Katniss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So many THG feels re: her and her gender role and her everything.

And now ANNE.

I first read Anne at the age of 7, I do believe. It wasn't ~formative in the sense that there were many other books I was objectively more passionate about, but oh how I loved it- an incessant bookworm from the moment I could toddle, I reread all of my owned books a thousand times until they fell apart, Anne most certainly included. And how I identified with her, especially as I got a little older, the way she'd screw up and use big words and scream and shout and ugh. Women with a temper have always been my true loves, always.

And really, has there ever been a more romantic moment then the bashing of a slate over a bemused teenage boy's head? *stars in eyes*

Basically Anne was one of many (ALSO JO MARCH!!!!!!!!) girls that I essentially fell in love with as a child, used to assemble my early misandristic tendencies because ladies for the rule always and forever, and really just what a beautiful series. CHILDHOOD NOSTALGIA AND FEISTY LADIES FOR THE WIN.

Date: 2013-12-17 07:37 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com
:D

Buffy. THE PLAY BETWEEN MASCULINE AND FEMININE YES YES. Like, she is ~blonde and likes ~boys and ~shopping and beyond that, she identifies so strongly as "just a girl." And yet she so often acts the masculine role esp. with her relationships and she definitely embodies the angsty action hero trope (in the best way possible) and ugh. She's just... the legitimate best ok.

Preeeeeach. The ~angsty action hero~ trope is possibly my favorite part?? Sorry not sorry but I eat up all the brooding about being the ~chosen one because the fact that EVERYTHING IS ABOUT THIS TINY BLONDE SUPERHERO in itself is fuckery to the max.

Now I'm curious about these other books that were more formative. SOME BOOKS THEY MUST HAVE BEEN.

And really, has there ever been a more romantic moment then the bashing of a slate over a bemused teenage boy's head? *stars in eyes*

Surely not. OTP.

JO MARCH!!!!!!!!! ;________;

Date: 2013-12-18 03:48 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] quietliban.livejournal.com
OMG ANNE OF GREEN GABLES. YOU HIT ME RIGHT IN THE FEELS. HOW DARE YOU.

I probably over identify with Anne Shirley waaay too much. I read them when I was eleven and I definitely imprinted. I mean pretty much how you describe Anne Shirley is how most of my family do describe me. /overshare.

So that was unexpected.

Also +1 to your gender-fuckery list because Darla tbh.

Date: 2013-12-18 07:07 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com
MY JOB IS DONE.

I mean pretty much how you describe Anne Shirley is how most of my family do describe me. /overshare.

You're not alone, you're never alone.

Date: 2013-12-19 04:00 am (UTC)
verdant_fire: (btvs: once in a generation)
From: [personal profile] verdant_fire
yes to this in general and to your Anne of Green Gables feels in particular. I loved those books. And of course:

thank God -- one Jo/Laurie is bad enough

A THOUSAND TIMES YES. Jo/Laurie is one of the first things I ever shipped, and I have not stopped. I'm pretty sure every literary girl who read those books was a little in love with Laurie. I have talked to other like-minded women who, like me, have never quite understood how Jo could turn that down. HE PLAYED THE PATHETIQUE SONATA FOR HER IN HIS HEARTBROKEN REJECTEDNESS. And then Jo immediately fell for someone old enough to be her dad and Laurie rebounded to Amy, wtf. raaaaaaage. I too have a best-friends-who-fall-in-love kink, and this was one of its greatest disappointments.

Date: 2013-12-19 09:04 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com
GIRL.

And then Jo immediately fell for someone old enough to be her dad and Laurie rebounded to Amy, wtf. raaaaaaage. I too have a best-friends-who-fall-in-love kink, and this was one of its greatest disappointments.

RIGHT? LIKE. IF YOU HADN'T MEANT FOR THAT TO BE A LOVE STORY, ALCOTT, YOU PROBABLY SHOULDN'T HAVE WRITTEN THEM AS BEING SO IN LOVE.

Date: 2014-03-18 02:30 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
it means a lot to me that Buffy didn't have to be masculinised in order to be the hero of the story. Her strength was in silly womanly things like emotions. And regardless of how you feel about the finale being PROBLEMATIC, I think we should all agree that taking an axe to everything the Council of Patriarchs stood for was in itself to be endorsed.

My best friend Kendra finally started watching BtVS and fell IN LOVE with Buffy in WTTH - for the very same reasons. She LOVES that Buffy knows how to stake a vamp AND what nailpolish is in that season. (And of course I love my friend and I love Buffy so this makes me absurdly happy.) I really do not get - at all - where people are coming from when they put her down for being "too masculine" or "too feminine". AT ALL.

Also my friends consider me a "femme" but I chop my own damn wood when I fire up the grill; and my mom is feminine but laid her own fiberglass and had a real toolkit (not this pink crap they put out nowadays) and can do anything so - yeah, I am Buffy's bitch, basically.

And very happy birthday, you! Day/month/week, as long as you like. Any plans?

Date: 2014-03-19 04:08 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ever-neutral.livejournal.com
\o/ Your friend Kendra is good job.

We all are Buffy's bitch lbr.

And thank you! I celebrated by going out and eating a creme brulee. :D

Date: 2014-03-19 12:07 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] red-satin-doll.livejournal.com
I have sooooo much love for my friend....then she told me that she can't stand Angel or Xander because she's known too many guys in her life "who think they owe it to you to love them just because that's what they want". *lol* Did I mention I love her? Smart gal.

Creme brulee is THE BEST THING. EVAH. Enjoy.

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