i don't give a damn if i'm your villain;

[ever_neutral]

03 | they are the worst possible thing to happen to each other

You and me, this was love.

This post will be a short one because (1) I expect Live Journal to choke on its interior mechanics and die, and (2) full disclosure: I... technically don't actually ship this anymore? My interest sadly fizzled out towards the end of the second season around the time the ship became bafflingly epic and starcrossed and one-true-love. I do still have some residual feelings about the Claire/Damien chemistry, but the pairing doesn't grab me like it used to. Which is a real shame, because in season one (and parts of season two), the Brody/Carrie relationship was probably the most compelling thing about the show for me -- and also one of the most gloriously destructive trainwrecks I've had the pleasure of witnessing, like, ever. I mean, does it actually get more fucked up than a terrorist and a CIA agent having an illicit affair? This is a relationship that started with her spying on him as part of the job, including watching his every private move on camera, before initiating a sexual relationship as a cover to (ostensibly) expose him; and when said exposing went awry he (and the rest of the world) basically gas-lit her into shock treatment. Now that is what I call fucking grade-A trainwrecking.

And the thing that made Brody/Carrie work (despite lbr, the sheer ludicrousness of the storyline) was the ambiguity of the entire affair. It wasn't romance, it was mutual manipulation -- except that it was romance, in some moments, when the cover slipped. Yet it was never a love story. It was never about the two being together; it was about simply asking what their relationship really was. It was about having everything you believed to be real called into question -- she the loyal officer protecting her country, he the devout traitor -- to the extent that a union entailing total betrayal of your firmest principles turns out unexpectedly to be your most emotionally intimate experience.

So, it's a shame the writers seemed to lose that thread in S2. I don't watch the show to see if Romeo and Juliet will make it work; I watch it to understand why two people on such drastically opposing sides would even be drawn to each other at all. In conclusion: I want to ship it again, and may S3 work with me.

Comments

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

Wait, wait, wait.

THAT'S DAMIEN LEWIS. THAT'S DAMIEN LEWIS.

I have been rec'd this show several times and the premise sounds awesome so I have been looking forward to watching it eventually but, what? Damien Lewis, what? LOL. LOL. LOL.

Carry on.

[ever-neutral.livejournal.com]

lol what's so hilarious about DAMIEN LEWIS? (is it Damien or Damian I forget)

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

Uhm, probably Damian? Since you say so anyway. I HAVE NEVER KNOWN YOU TO BE WRONG, YOU ARE A TRUE SAGE D:

IDK. I guess it's not THAT funny. I just forget that he is fo srs in the U.S of A (and by extension, the big wide world). Where I am from he is mainly famous for his charm/success on the chat-show-format? Also his class-based elitism. And his support of Liverpool F.C. And his not-so-shiny-or-successful roles (we dig those). And that his wife is much more famous than he is.

So yeah, he's everywhere and I kind of feel like he's one of us? HIS ACTING SUCCESS FEELS WEIRD BASICALLY, even though I know he's worked with Spielberg. Heh.

[ever-neutral.livejournal.com]

Where I am from he is mainly famous for his charm/success on the chat-show-format? Also his class-based elitism. And his support of Liverpool F.C. And his not-so-shiny-or-successful roles (we dig those). And that his wife is much more famous than he is.
L O L. I see.

HIS ACTING SUCCESS FEELS WEIRD BASICALLY, even though I know he's worked with Spielberg.
He also just won an Academy Award so there you go. ;P

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

OKAY I WENT ON TUMBLR AND IT APPEARS HE HAS A FANDOM.

WITH GIFS.

(lol)

I AM SORRY FOR NOT BELIEVING IN HIM.

[catteo.livejournal.com]

But we love Damien more BECAUSE he is one of us that has now reached the dizzying heights of Hollywood fame and yet somehow maintains his class elitism and makes the most hilarious upper middle class acceptance speeches. Seriously. You should youtube some of this shit!

[ever-neutral.livejournal.com]

lol is that directed towards me? I'll be sure to put it on my to-do list. ;P

[catteo.livejournal.com]

Ha! It was in fact directed at cranmers who appears to have lost Damien when he moved over the ocean to play with Hollywood. But you should feel free to youtube some of that shit too!

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

So I talked to my parents and I was like "hey, so Damian Lewis has this major new show in the land of McDonald's, we should check it out" and, *drum-roll* IT TURNED OUT THEY ALREADY HAD CHECKED IT OUT... And that it was, in fact, the sole reason they now had Sky, and that while I was at university, Damian had been all over the usual chat-shows (on both sides of the Pond, now, appaz) bragging about it as per usual. And ofc. my whole family and their entire social circle are very happy for him indeed (he is still one of ussss, yeesssss?). They sent me the DVD. So, there's that.

Now I shall follow your advice and youtube him, though I still view him as a sort of popular uncle. IDEK.

(lol)

[catteo.livejournal.com]

This entire freaking comment MADE MY NIGHT. WE ARE FROM THE EMPIRE YO AND WE WILL CONQUER YOUR COUNTRY ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.

/imperial overlord chat

SKIP TO 1:20 IT IS AWESOME but maybe only to those of us that understand about "DOING WELL AT ACTING"

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

LMFAO. But that is bad.

/it's who we are, both of us together.

DOING.WELL.AT.ACTING

... that was the very best ^^

And Gangham Styleeee

[catteo.livejournal.com]

DANCING DAMIAN!!!!!!

Oh Daily Mail, HOW I MISS YOU AND YOUR QUIPS.

And your information that is in no way biased and/or untrue.

I JUST LIKE DAMIAN AND HIS VERY PUBLIC SCHOOL BOY ATTITUDE A WHOLE LOT.

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

YUSSSSS!

So I'm on my phone, about to go to bed, but if I don't post this comment I will probably not even sleep. I FORGOT TO ADD A DISCLAIMER SAYING THAT THE DAILY FAIL IMAGE IS FROM TUMBLR - IT'S MERELY MEANT AS FURTHER PROOF OF THE FACT THAT OUTSIDE HOLLYWOOD DAMIAN LEWIS (AND INDEED HELEN MCCRORY) IS A MUCH LOVED, AVUNCULAR FIGURE TO ONE AND ALL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH - AND OFC I WOULD NEVER PURCHASE THE DAILY FAIL UNDER ANY CIRUMSTANCES AND ALL MY REFERENCES TO NEEDING PAUL DACRE TO SAVE US ARE IN FACT MEANT TO BE TAKEN AS SARCASM.

IDK. It randomly occured to me that I may have unwittingly misrepresented my sociopolitical convinctions by seeming to endorse the fail- had to rush to correct that! Sometimes I glance at headlines though. I'll admit that. :P I think it was the Mail that ran with "Fred the Pleb" after ~Sir Fred Goodwin was stripped of his knighthood? Because that was good. Also "Gordon Green: he robs from the dirty and gives to the clean" after some Labour 'green' tax initiative was another good one I seem to remember came from a tabloid. I REMEMBER THE MOST RANDOM THINGS. IDEK.

Me too. Oddly, there is something about institutional privilege that makes one appealing to like, tje most crazy diverse groups of people. Like Tom Hiddleston. Or Boris Johnson. Or Bertie Wooster. Or Hector Madden though I suspect that's just me but Dominic West Y/Y?

This comment is way too long. Longest phone comment I've ever done, probs -I KNOW YOU WILL APPRECIATE IT THOUGH. It will probably lift a load off your mind re my taste in newspapers as well. *nods*

/imperial overlord talk suspended.

Except wait what? Did you used to live in the land where the Daily Fail is published?! I thought that was just Leesa!

[catteo.livejournal.com]

So I am late in responding to this, but I was DYING LAUGHING at the fact that you thought I would think less of you for reading the Daily Fail! My mum used to read it back in the day and I used to snigger at her from behind the front page of The Times when it used to be a broadsheet! Of course, I would steal it later for the horoscopes and the sudoku!

I just find the front page headlines to be excellent. Same with all the tabloids tbh!

I LOVE ALL THE BOYS THAT YOU MENTIONED. They are the perfect examples. It's because they were brought up to open the door for you and they're TERRIBLY SELF-DEPRECATING. It's hot.

I DID APPRECIATE THIS ENTIRE COMMENT!

And YES! I grew up in the UK. I only moved here 4 years ago. I AM A POMMIE THINLY DISGUISED AS A KIWI! Don't tell anyone though...

[catteo.livejournal.com]

WTF HOW IS IT POSSIBLE THAT YOU ARE NOT WATCHING THIS SHOW?!

You should sort that shit out. Soon. It's fabulous.

Sorry for the hijack, but really, this is a PSA!

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

I plan to! I plan to!

It's next on my list after Firefly.

Prostate-Specific Antigen?

THAT'S WHAT GOOGLE COMES UP WITH FOR PSA. IDK.

[catteo.livejournal.com]

Hahahahahaha *iz ded*

Although that would be a totally valid explanation in my usual line of work and I am very glad that google has its priorities in order. But I meant Public Service Announcement. Either way, this news makes me very glad. It seems that this little corner of lj is slowly catching up with The Hour. At least then if it never comes back I have loads of people to keep flailing with!

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

OH I SEE.

That does make more sense, you know.

I'm pretty sure it will get renewed. I mean, it will be an actual crime if it doesn't so....

[next_to_normal]

Yeah, basically. Though I don't know that they lost the thread so much as they deliberately shifted gears because this is where they wanted to end up? I'm starting to realize that the writers had a very different idea of the pairing than the audience did. When they described the show as "a demented love story," clearly they were more focused on the "love story" while we were all focused on the "demented" part. :-\

[ever-neutral.livejournal.com]

That makes me want to give up on life and existence tbh.

[rosaxx50.livejournal.com]

My interest sadly fizzled out towards the end of the second season around the time the ship became bafflingly epic and starcrossed and one-true-love.

Always.

And CIA Agent/Terrorist ship of mutual manipulation? I could get behind that.

[angearia.livejournal.com]

Riiiight, the illicit fucked-up-ness of their Season 1 relationship and the shadow games of it all. Once they established they were The Only Trustworthy Ones, it kinda fell apart. Fingers crossed that they betray each other in Season 3.

[bellonablack.livejournal.com]

e -- and also one of the most gloriously destructive trainwrecks I've had the pleasure of witnessing, like, ever.


I have never watched this yet...but this feels me with LONGING. 0-0

...<3

[catteo.livejournal.com]

Well this is the most accurate thing in the history of ever regarding these two! I shipped them HARD during S1, but not in a 'star-crossed lovers' way rather, like you, in a fascinated 'how far are these people going to go to manipulate each other' kind of a way. I also lost interest rather when it started to become clear that this was more about the romance than the maipulation. I mean, I still find it fascinating that Carrie's belief in Brody would be the only thing to pull him back from the edge, but I don't know that I can really get behind this couple as true love. I can understand obsession and lust and I guess that was the thing that really drew me to them initially, that the lines were so blurred between what was real and what was lies. The thing that saved this pairing for me for parts of S2 was that Quinn and Saul didn't really seem to know how much of it was an act and so I bought into that for a time. But then it became clear that the writers were going down the road of love and trust and that is so not what I want out of these two. I want it to still be unclear if Brody is the good guy. I want Carrie to still have doubt. I don't want S3 to be all about her feels for Brody and her being incomplete without him. What I really want is for her and Peter Quinn to start having a relationship of mutual contempt where they sling insults at each other all day but then have make-up sex. Clearly I should be doing this meme!

[ever-neutral.livejournal.com]

DUDE I AM SO GLAD YOU AGREE. \o/ I have no idea what general Homeland fandom thinks in a comprehensive sense but from what I've gathered it seems Brody/Carrie is still everyone's OTP. (Why.) Le sigh. #when good ships go bad

I don't want S3 to be all about her feels for Brody and her being incomplete without him. What I really want is for her and Peter Quinn to start having a relationship of mutual contempt where they sling insults at each other all day but then have make-up sex.
YOU TOO? Clearly we should wed.

And yes, DO THE MEME. Om nom nom. \o/

[catteo.livejournal.com]

Of COURSE I agree. Because this is really the only rational opinion! From what I've seen fandom is sort of torn. A lot of people seemed to be pissed off with the turn of events following Carrie's abduction by Nazir. I saw a lot of posts accusing the show of venturing into fantasy territory with the way that things were handled. I think that it's a tough one because we all seemed to ship them in S1 and it's tough to let go of a ship even when it's totally mishandled. I think that those that are still shipping them as OTP are doing it despite what's happening on screen. I have been guilty of this myself before - you see what you want to see not the relationship that's really happening!

WE SHOULD! This is clearly the OTP of the future. I was so excited to see that Quinn would be playing a "significant role" in Season 3. I was SO worried that they would jettison him to the great beyond. But I'm hopeful that Saul will work out that Quinn made his own choices and reward him with a job in the team. And you know what happens when people that "hate" each other have to work in close proximity for any period of time!

I think that I will embark upon it this weekend. Nothing if not impressionable!

[ever-neutral.livejournal.com]

I think that those that are still shipping them as OTP are doing it despite what's happening on screen.
Haha IDK! While I was rummaging around in the Brody/Carrie tag for gifs I saw a lot of flailing over how tragic and epic they are. So.

I was so excited to see that Quinn would be playing a "significant role" in Season 3.
:O \o/ \o/ \o/

I anticipate your wrong!shipping.

[cranmers.livejournal.com]

YAY THIS MEME WILL BE EXCELLENT FOR YOU.

(YAY.)

Looking forward to it.